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Post by captainbasil on Nov 9, 2012 12:48:51 GMT -5
I'm still wiped because of how the election went, even though it turned out the way I had feared. I hoped like hell I would be wrong though. I hear you. I'm more disappointed by the Massachusetts senate race. Obama's re-election was always a possibility but I was shocked that Scott Brown wasn't re-elected. And it was very close. Well, never thought I'd have cause to quote a Star Wars prequel but... "So this is how liberty dies: with thunderous applause." -TK I live in Massachusetts too. I was pretty disappointed. I really liked and respected Brown. MA doesn't like that pesky checks and balances thing. It's one party rule. Back on topic. While I like Season 2, I feel that, overall, B5's rookie season is one of the best of any science fiction show's first year. |
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Feb 21, 2013 19:58:32 GMT -5
Wow ...I'm gonna have to read this when I have more time.
Over at io9:The Strange, Secret Evolution of Babylon 5Feb 21, 2013 Jason Shankel  February 22, 2013, marks the 20th anniversary of the premiere of Babylon 5: The Gathering, the pilot film for what would eventually become the Babylon 5 television series. More » io9.com/5985727/the-strange-secret-evolution-of-babylon-5
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Mar 15, 2013 1:28:35 GMT -5
Recommended Viewing -
This is a really Cool scene from "Babylon 5" that was just brought to my attention. For me this amounted to a blast from the past, but I highly recommend that people give it a view, especially anyone here who still hasn't given "Babylon 5" a chance even after all this time. It might whet your appetite for more, and what's also nifty about it is that it takes place in this Solar System. Check it out, and impressions after the fact are of course most welcome. I'd love to hear what one of the uninitiated here might have to say concerning it.
But be sure to bump the video quality up to maximum first via the Settings option.
White Star at Ganymede (Full version)
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Post by StarFuryG7 on May 29, 2013 11:23:13 GMT -5
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Post by TK on May 29, 2013 13:16:09 GMT -5
Yeah, I saw that this morning. I liked O'Hare, and I'm glad to know that writing him out was a necessary evil, and not some corporate nonsense.
Still haven't finished the series. I'll have to get back to that soon.
-TK
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Post by Mel on May 30, 2013 13:20:10 GMT -5
Wow ...I'm gonna have to read this when I have more time. |
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Post by Mel on May 30, 2013 13:40:11 GMT -5
From the article below: G'Kar transitions from self-serving political player concerned with doing well to a beleaguered military commander concerned with doing good and ultimately to a respected spiritual leader concerned with doing right. It is the best and most touching character arc on the show. Great Maker! That's a damn good article. G'Kar was great and I loved him, but Londo stole my heart.
More » io9.com/5985727/the-strange-secret-evolution-of-babylon-5[/quote] |
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jun 1, 2013 0:44:51 GMT -5
Wow ...I'm gonna have to read this when I have more time.
A lot of the time I don't read the articles I post right away though. Sometimes I do, but sometimes I'll post them and go back to them a little later on in the day when I have more time. Sometimes it's right away, sometimes not. |
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jun 1, 2013 0:47:49 GMT -5
Yeah, I saw that this morning. I liked O'Hare, and I'm glad to know that writing him out was a necessary evil, and not some corporate nonsense. Still haven't finished the series. I'll have to get back to that soon. -TK
Just out of curiosity, how far in did you get? |
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jun 1, 2013 6:39:42 GMT -5
I got one or two episodes into season 2, but then life got in the way, and then I was watching other things. So after I'm done plowing through Fringe, I may get back to it.
-TK
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Post by captainbasil on Jun 1, 2013 7:01:55 GMT -5
I really liked Michael O'Hare and it's a shame that things turned out for him the way they did. It's been a hard luck show. We have lost so many cast members for a show that's only 20 years old. It still remains one of my favorite science fiction programs of all time. As for committing to watching the series, it is basically a 5 season novel. So I understand people not having the time to sit down and watch it. I watched it once a week when it originally aired and sometimes I would be behind an episode or two.
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jun 2, 2013 18:05:21 GMT -5
Note to CRAM --this may be the "Babylon 5" thread, but Shatner comes up here nonetheless.
So I watched the Phoenix Con 20th Anniversary "Babylon 5" gathering on my TV via YouTube last night. It's two parts, and part 1 really is a mess because of audio issues that plague the segment on and off throughout its half-hour running time. From there I moved on to Part 2, where they cleaned up their act and the audio problems were resolved, except for the occasional actor who wasn't speaking loud enough to be heard. Walter Koenig looks like an old man now here, and he's one of the people who weren't doing the greatest at projecting his voice over the microphone. But it got to a point in Part 2 where he mentioned Shatner, there were a few boos in the crowd, and Jerry Doyle interjected by flat-out calling Shatner "a Douchebag", and then repeated it a few more times. I gather the two have met, probably more than once at Conventions like this one, but he didn't hold back, nor am I that surprised by it because he's a very outspoken guy, and not always the nicest person himself evidently.
Anyway, here are the links if any of you are interested in checking it out. I made it through the whole thing last night in one sitting, which surprised me. I never thought I would make it through all of Part 2 last night, which runs for an hour and twenty-one minutes. Doyle also tells a few funny stories about Andreas Katsulas and how cheap he was in life --didn't hold back on that either.
You might want to just avoid Part 1 and go right to Part 2 if you're of a mind to watch any of it.
Babylon 5 20th reunion pt1 Phoenix Comicon
Babylon 5 20th Reunion HD Part 2 Phoenix Comicon (good audio)
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 10, 2013 23:04:15 GMT -5
Finally finished Fringe. Didn't end too badly, though the series as a whole remained kind of a mess. But considering the writers involved, that's not surprising. Not really sure why we needed to jump ahead in time either, which is never a good sign for a series, nor do I understand WHY the Observers were changing the past. What was the motivation? And why does human evolution equal pasty guys with alopecia who dress like insurance salesmen? I was bugged we never learned how Bell got in the amber, and it still bothers me that from season 4 on this isn't reallyour timeline, even if Peter is there now and Olivia has those memories. But on the whole they managed to end it reasonably satisfactorily, and I was glad they addressed the paradox of Walter's plan. Not a perfect series, probably not even as good as people said it was, and I could have MANY a discussion on why it's most basic elements as it went on made no sense or were contradictory, but it didn't end as the disaster that BSG did for example.
why am I talking about Fringe in the Babylon 5 thread? Because having finished Fringe means that I can finally get back to watching Babylon 5. I've got season 2 in from the library, and I've decided since it's been so long that I'm going to go back and watch "Signs and Portents" and "Chrysalis" first, just to refresh myself. I'll try to update as I go. ...I'm also greatly resisting the urge to rewatch Breaking Bad before the finale in order to do this...
-TK
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jul 11, 2013 9:51:31 GMT -5
I'd like to look at at least part of the fourth season of "Breaking Bad" before it returns next month for its final eight episodes, but otherwise I'm caught up and finished looking at Season three, which I hadn't seen previously, last month on Blu-ray. I particularly got a kick out of the episode titled simply "Fly" from that season.
I agree with you about "Fringe". It was a very disjointed series which certainly could have been better in many respects, and I found the last season to be a particular disappointment because the whole jump ahead in the timeline was unnecessary. They could and should have made the present more interesting instead. Lord knows they already had enough going on in that period. As for the motives of the Observers, they just wanted to control things and also change the climate to better suit their physiology in the future, and they weren't really a natural evolution of humanity in general. They were an anomoly, a freak of nature that were nothing more than a mutation. As for William Bell, I didn't care for the way things were left off with respect to him either, nor the inexplicable Jekyll and Hyde nature of the character over the course of the series.
Nice to hear you're about to start watching season 2 of B5 shortly. Things begin to change and also heat up there. Don't hesitate to pose a question in my direction if you're curious about something.
Now if we could only get CRAM to start watching it too.
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 11, 2013 17:15:41 GMT -5
I'd like to look at at least part of the fourth season of "Breaking Bad" before it returns next month for its final eight episodes, but otherwise I'm caught up and finished looking at Season three, which I hadn't seen previously, last month on Blu-ray. I particularly got a kick out of the episode titled simply "Flya' from that season. Funny you mention "Fly", which is one of the most divisive episodes of the series. Some fans love it, and others think it's a total waste of time. I probably fall somewhere in the middle; I have no strong feelings about it either way. Though as bottle episodes go, I think the one where they were stranded in the desert was stronger. Still, as someone who has experienced the frustration of needing to kill the fly (or in my case, flies) that disturb you in your work, it has a certain truth to it. The one thing about the series as it goes on is I miss that it's not as funny as it used to be. Maybe I'll make time for a rewatch. I've got a month. Back to B5, I don't have to worry about any of the movies until season 3, right? -TK |
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jul 11, 2013 18:51:15 GMT -5
Funny you mention "Fly", which is one of the most divisive episodes of the series. Some fans love it, and others think it's a total waste of time. I probably fall somewhere in the middle; I have no strong feelings about it either way. Though as bottle episodes go, I think the one where they were stranded in the desert was stronger. Still, as someone who has experienced the frustration of needing to kill the fly (or in my case, flies) that disturb you in your work, it has a certain truth to it. The one thing about the series as it goes on is I miss that it's not as funny as it used to be. Maybe I'll make time for a rewatch. I've got a month. They made it funny, and the chemistry between Aaron Paul and Bryan Cranston is what made it work. If the episode wasn't as amusing as I found it to be ("We have...a contamination"), then I likely would have viewed it as a waste of time too, but the writing was also good, and character consistent. We also get to see there the extent to which everything that has happened, and the deaths he's caused, is weighing on Walt's conscience. So while it may be a bottle episode, we wouldn't have gotten to really see that anywhere else I don't think. I also liked the episode where they get stuck in the desert by the way. >>Back to B5, I don't have to worry about any of the movies until season 3, right?<< Actually, you don't have to worry about them till the end of season 4, so you have two full seasons to go. |
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 15, 2013 9:10:33 GMT -5
So four episodes into season 2 now. I like that the opening credits now put faces with the names, though that also spoiled the Delenn reveal. Why not use an old shot from last season for those first two episodes?
The story with the Drozi fighting for no reason seemed a blatant tweak of "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield" with maybe a dash of "Captive Pursuit". Whether the story existed before or was just written to cover Claudia Christian's broken foot issue, I don't know. But it was rather silly, like an entire society is based around one big game of capture the flag. Yes, it's probably supposed to reflect gang warfare of the time, but feels trite to me.
Sheridan's got a dead wife, eh? Like a certain other station commander...
Okay so far, though it feels like every episode has a silly subplot, like early TNG. The purple/green war was bad enough, but the Doctor putting everyone on a diet... that's Michelle Obama's America right there.
-TK
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jul 15, 2013 11:18:28 GMT -5
>>So four episodes into season 2 now. I like that the opening credits now put faces with the names, though that also spoiled the Delenn reveal. Why not use an old shot from last season for those first two episodes?<<
People complained about that after it first aired, and rightly so, although I don't remember how JMS responded. I'm sure he didn't like it either, but he probably cited it as a budget issue.
>>The story with the Drozi fighting for no reason seemed a blatant tweak of "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield" with maybe a dash of "Captive Pursuit". Whether the story existed before or was just written to cover Claudia Christian's broken foot issue, I don't know. But it was rather silly, like an entire society is based around one big game of capture the flag. Yes, it's probably supposed to reflect gang warfare of the time, but feels trite to me.<<
I was very hard on Joe for that episode because it's just so damn ridiculous.
>>Sheridan's got a dead wife, eh? Like a certain other station commander...<<
:::Ahem::: I'm holding my tongue here.
>>Okay so far, though it feels like every episode has a silly subplot, like early TNG.<<
Stick with it. Season two is where things begin to change and ramp up.
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 21, 2013 12:21:17 GMT -5
I'm now about halfway through season 2. Things are picking up though it's still a lot of groundwork being laid and with not a whole lot actually happening. Reminds me of some of the X-files mythology stuff in that regard. It's an odd sense that on one hand we have the dramatic irony that we know Londo is in league with the Shadows though no one else has any idea, and yet we know very little else about their agenda or the broader strokes of what's going on. So the show is playing on this weird level of keeping the audience in the dark and letting them in on stuff simultaneously.
It was good to see Sinclair again, if only briefly.
Seeing Harlan Ellison's "creative consultant" credit every episode makes me wonder how much involvement he actually had early on, or if this was yet another attempt at appeasing the most litigious of scif-fi writers.
I know it's silly, but every time I hear Londo's name I start humming "Volare" in my head. "Mollari... oh oh, Centauri... oh oh oh oh..."
Looking at the exteriors of B5 it always looks to me almost like it's made of Legos. Which said to me that someone at some time must have tried to just that. Here's one really good attempt:
-TK
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jul 22, 2013 9:13:50 GMT -5
I'm now about halfway through season 2. Things are picking up though it's still a lot of groundwork being laid and with not a whole lot actually happening. Reminds me of some of the X-files mythology stuff in that regard. It's an odd sense that on one hand we have the dramatic irony that we know Londo is in league with the Shadows though no one else has any idea, and yet we know very little else about their agenda or the broader strokes of what's going on. So the show is playing on this weird level of keeping the audience in the dark and letting them in on stuff simultaneously. It was good to see Sinclair again, if only briefly. Seeing Harlan Ellison's "creative consultant" credit every episode makes me wonder how much involvement he actually had early on, or if this was yet another attempt at appeasing the most litigious of scif-fi writers. I know it's silly, but every time I hear Londo's name I start humming "Volare" in my head. "Mollari... oh oh, Centauri... oh oh oh oh..." Looking at the exteriors of B5 it always looks to me almost like it's made of Legos. Which said to me that someone at some time must have tried to just that. -TK I take it you've passed "The Coming of Shadows", but have you gotten to "In the Shadow of Z'ha'dum" yet? |
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 22, 2013 9:31:27 GMT -5
At the time of posting, I was a couple episodes away, but I have now gotten up through "In the Shadow of Z'Ha'Dum". At least we get some answers there.
Although some stuff like the introduction of the Ministry of Peace or whatever they call themselves was pretty obvious and heavy-handed. No one finds anything suspicious about being paid to be an extra patrol? Everyone's fine with "keeping the peace" that way? Maybe if it had been voluntary like a Neighborhood Watch or something I could buy it, but offering extra pay is an immediate red flag and it surprised me that no one walked out or anything.
The opening narration says this is the "third age of mankind". I wonder what they other two ages were supposed to be.
-TK
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Post by Mel on Jul 23, 2013 12:45:30 GMT -5
OMG, that's funny. At my age, I can be fairly hopeful that, by the next time I watch B5, I'll have long forgotten this association with my favorite character. 
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 24, 2013 19:33:00 GMT -5
OMG, that's funny. At my age, I can be fairly hopeful that, by the next time I watch B5, I'll have long forgotten this association with my favorite character. Mel, can I just say I love to see your posts every now and then? It's infrequent, but having you pipe in helps freshen the environs on these boards. -TK |
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Jul 24, 2013 19:59:34 GMT -5
Okay, just finished season 2. It's okay, and I grew to like Sheridan pretty quickly, which is good. At times JMS is done in by his own writerly approach to things. "It's like a novel!!" which means it's a whole season of a lot of set-up but little pay-off so far. A lot of that can be fine, but at times all the "something's coming! the Shadows are coming! ...No seriously, when it does, watch out!" gets frustrating. He's also got a tendency to get a little hamfisted in his analogies. To the point of ending the season not simply with an obviously Churchillian storyline, but by having the character actually say "peace in our time". I look at something like DS9's "Duet", which has obvious parallels to the holocaust, but it plays well on its own and doesn't indicate itself so strongly. At times too I think the plotting of some of the characters arcs could be a little smoother. Londo had that one great bit where he kept wanting to have a drink with Garibaldi, the only guy left who was sort of a friend, and it didn't happen. But the season ends with him just kind of a different guy and some of that organic transition was lost. Not quite as jarring as when Dukat suddenly went all pagh-wraith on us, but still kinda gave me this "serving the greater story" impression.
A lot of good guest stars on the show though.
As with season 1, here's my thoughts on some standout episodes:
A Race Through Dark Places -- Koenig's back! Again, not much for the Psi Corps stuff, but it's improved a bit here. And I generally hate Talia, so it was nice to see her have something of a good moment (before they went and trap-doored her).
There All the Honor Lies -- with the B-story about the station store which just happened to sell rubber masks, I really expected the two stories to link up and the Minbari who attacked Sheridan turn out to be some other guy in a Minbari mask trying to frame them. But no, it was just another silly Ivanova side story.
And Now For a Word -- I'd suspect this is something of a fan favorite, which happens a lot with episodes that change the format. I liked the little psi-corps commercial, right down to the subliminal messaging at the end.
Confessions and Lamentations -- seems like an attempt to tell an AIDS story, but much better than other series have done, probably because it kept it to more Black Plague connection.
Divided Loyalties -- hey, Lyta's back! And Talia's evil (duh). I liked Lyta so it was good to see her again. This is another episode with some pretty cliched writing where Ivanova is pushed on the audience as the potential mole, so obviously it can't be her. It was just a bluff that was played so hard that there was no real surprise when Talia was revealed. It was nice to get that extra wrinkle that Ivanova is a latent telepath though.
Comes the Inquisitor -- and here's where I slap my forehead. It's weird enough that the Vorlons apparently abducted some british dude and have been "preserving" him for hundreds of years so he can do some weird psychological interrogation. But then it's Jack the Ripper. Come on. Why is he Jack the Ripper? What possible use is that to the story at all? "Wolf in the Fold" was a Jack the Ripper story I could go with. Here it's just so random and silly to me. And after all the secret meetings and Delenn transforming herself, now Kosh won't trust her unless Jack the Ripper slaps her around?
The Fall of Night -- ...and Kosh is an angel? Is that what you're telling me? Yes, the alien visitors being taken for gods/angels is a sci-fi trope and there's nothing wrong with that. TOS did it, DS9 did it, C.S. Lewis did it kind of, even the Bible speaks of Paul and Barnabas being mistaken for Greek gods. But something about this just really bothered me. I liked the idea of Vorlons being secretive and/or needing their "encounter suits". But we build up this mystery and that's it? He's a flying angel being? And the Vorlons have visited all these worlds before, so everyone has some legend about them? Not to mention that now we've got the "evil" Shadows of "darkness" who are opposed by these angelic beings of light! Somehow in the way this was handled was just all too cute for me and kind of a letdown. And I've already mentioned the Churchill stuff.
And the season just ends awkwardly with a voice-over. What was that? We finally get to the war that the opening narration has been teasing us with, and it's a kind of quick "oh yeah, and then war was declared" voice over? Maybe that was a butt-covering move in case the series wasn't renewed, maybe they ran out of time in the episode, but it was one of the more jarring endings since Quantum Leap's finale.
-TK
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Post by StarFuryG7 on Jul 25, 2013 11:48:07 GMT -5
I think you missed the point regarding "Comes the Inquisitor". He gives the reason he was sent at the end of the episode. During his time Jack the Ripper believed he was doing the right thing in order to send a message. The Vorlons observe him, see what he's doing, and decide to study him out of curiosity. Upon realizing what made him tick, they then decide to show him the error of his ways as only they can. Kosh and his people want to know how deep Delenn's conviction is regarding the mission she sees herself as having to undertake. They know what she will find herself up against regarding the evil she will have to confront in dealing with the Shadows, although here's a tipoff: the Shadows don't see themselves as evil. They feel what they're doing is for the greater good of all even though it isn't. That's a bit of a Spoiler, but watch them and their methods and decide for yourself about that once all is said and done. But that's why the Vorlons take Jack the Ripper out of cold storage to interrogate Delenn. Having said that, I'm not really a big fan of that episode nonetheless, even though that's how Straczynski justifies that story. I viewed the whole pretext as specious, and the episode as a whole as needless exposition that was therefore a waste of time.
I could comment on some of your other observations, and perhaps I will over the weekend, but I simply do not have the time to do it right now. However, in having read through your entire post it struck me that you didn't have one good thing to say about the second season. Your critique was very critical, so I would therefore recommend that if that is truly how you feel about the show, then you need not watch it any further. You'll only find yourself being just as negative, or even worse, looking at the seasons that follow. "Babylon 5" just isn't for you apparently.
And Joe's writing has a tendency of getting on my nerves as well for what it's worth, although I was mainly bothered by it from season three onward. There's a familiarity to his style that makes you wish he was part of a writing team rather than churning out scripts by himself episode after episode. Some of his work is great, don't get me wrong. "Severed Dreams" is among his best, and I could name others. However, he also did himself and the viewers a disservice at times by writing everything himself, and his ideological views can also be irritating, especially if you don't agree with him. Nevertheless, he keeps pushing them on you.
But don't bother with "Babylon 5" anymore if that's how you feel.
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Post by TK on Jul 25, 2013 13:11:19 GMT -5
I got the point of "Comes the Inquisitor", I just thought it was stupid. Like you said, I found the whole thing specious and kind of a waste of time. Particularly where it fell in the season. Had it been earlier, I might have been a tad less critical. I was really starting to suspect "Sebastian" of being a Shadow spy.
I thought I did mention things I liked. I liked some of the guest stars, I liked "And now a Word", I like Sheridan. But other things bugged me. I dont' necessarily have a problem with the story, but the way it's unfolding does feel too manipulated at times.
I'm in this for the long haul. At present I'm not like blown away by the series, but it's also not making me consistently scream at the TV like BSG, or constantly scratch my head like Fringe. I can at least see why it has a following.
-TK
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Post by Mel on Jul 25, 2013 18:52:19 GMT -5
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Aug 10, 2013 16:40:23 GMT -5
Well, I'm now a little more than halfway through season 3 (finished the King Arthur one yesterday). I'll post further thoughts on the season when I've finished it. But as I near season 4, I wonder when you'd suggest is the best time to watch various movies. There used to be a good thread about it over on IMDb, but they've purged a lot of the older threads recently.
-TK
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Post by TrekBeatTK on Aug 14, 2013 23:31:52 GMT -5
Finished season 3 today. Pretty good overall, though JMS's hubris of writing the whole thing himself definitely leaves some episodes or threads not as strong as they could have been. Also I feel like some stuff was done in by the order the episodes were aired, like some bits would play better in a different order.
JMS is kind of a pretentious tool who doesn't seem to realize his audience is not only smarter than he gives them credit for, but is generally smarter than he is. He comes off like a college writing professor who has a crappy book published that no one read, but at least he's a "real" writer. And I say this as someone with a degree in creative writing; we can smell our own. Joe just comes across as someone who thinks he's smarter than he is. His commentary tracks are exercises in pedantic sophistry (though I should really avoid them anyway, since he likes to get spoilerific). The commentary for "Z'Ha'Dum" had him name dropping Hitchcock, Chekov, Faulkner, Twain, Robert Frost, and others. It screams, "look at me, I read!"
As annoying as he is as a person and writer, it's amazing then that the series works as well as it does. There are still story elements that I find poorly thought out or executed, but a steady improvement.
Why does Ivanova get to do the opening narration? I like when the captains did it. Is someone new going to do it in season 4? Ultimately it was mostly just stuff she said at the end of last season anyway.
The introduction of the Marcus character was helpful in keeping a face to the Rangers. To date they'd been established in like one prior episode and that was it. At times he's a bit too esoteric a personality with his Gaius Baltar beard, but a welcome addition on the whole.
The good guest stars continue. For all the show's flaws, they sure attracted good talent.
Things about the Shadows' plans make no sense to me. I get them playing sides against each other. But I really don't understand at this point what President Clarke's motivations are for anything he does. We know the Shadows have his ear, and we know there's some conspiracy with Psi Corps, but why? And that seems like conflicting interests to me since the Shadows and the telepaths are opposing forces. So the move to suddenly declare martial law felt like it came out of nowhere, when it could have been structured to arise more organically. Similarly with the rushed escalation (and then quick disposal) of the Night Watch. It would have been far more believable for them to step up their actions AFTER acts of supposed sedition started, rather than seeking them out from the start. Moves like this are much more effective when the public can see a reason for it and it arises as reaction. That's why the Patriot Act went into effect and why we have a war on terror. But here Joe structured the story so that Night Watch are essentially the instigators, and that's just foolish. Despite the way this was all handled, it's interesting to see B5 go independent. And I like the new outfits. I just wish it had been better plotted to get to that point.
I could kind of do without the notion of the Shadow vessels using live pilots. I grow weary of the "living ships" thing on TV, though I guess at the time it wasn't as prevalent. where do they get the bodies to run these vessels? Also, no one seems to have any qualms about blowing up Shadow ships knowing there are people inside them. I guess it's another contrast to the Vorlon vessels.
The revelation of there having been a ship found on Mars and how that's all been covered up annoyed me a bit, though I guess it serves as a reason for the Icarus to go to Z'Ha'Dum. And suggests that Clark is somehow involved with the Shadows and all. But it was one extra revelation I'm not sure was needed.
If I sound very negative, it's only because I know what he was going for and I know it could have been done better. But that shouldn't take away from the times it really works. There are some good character moments here as well. I'll elucidate more I liked (and a bit I didn't) with my usual look at select episodes:
Convictions -- Londo and G'Kar trapped in an elevator took a TV cliche and turned it on it's head. I LOVE that they don't ultimately work together (or deliver a baby or something). Instead G'Kar is just gleeful to watch Londo die. That's great. And as it's one of the few times this season these two are really together like the old days, it's a good way to cap their relationship for awhile.
Passing Through Gethsemane -- My favorite of the season. A bit of a silly notion with monks on the station, but pretty well executed beyond that. Poor Brad Dourif really is type-cast as the crazy, haunted serial killer, isn't he? It's like a cross between Voyager's "Meld" and X-Files' "Beyond the Sea". I think it might have been better to establish the personality wipe in a prior episode; it's a teeny bit of exposition dump. But it's a different slant on the "capital punishment" argument played as a straight character piece.
Exogenesis -- again, the hostile alien takeover trope is undone when it turns out they are generally benevolent. I think the notion of this kind of symbiotic history preservation is kind of ridiculous, but I can't say I've seen it before. Although... why couldn't any other writer have written this one, Joe?
Severed Dreams -- Good, if not as good as it should have been. Again, the story structure is all wrong and leaves me just confused about Clark's ultimate goals here. JMS rights politics like someone who doesn't understand them. Why does Clark do these things? "Because he's bad!" Yeah, but why is he bad? what is he hoping to gain? "...He's bad!" Okay, but WHY is he bad? "...he... the Shadows are behind it, and they're BAD!"
Sic Transit Vir -- a great episode highlighting Vir. His betrothed may be a racist, but she sure was hot, even for a bald chick. Maybe I've just got a soft spot for Vir because back in high school the seniors used to call me Flounder.
A Late Delivery From Avalon -- ...and then this happened. Just as things were getting good, Michael York shows up claiming to be King Arthur. No. Just no. Not as bad as Jack the Ripper showing up (and the fact they even entertained that the same thing might have happened made me nervous). It plays out okay ultimately, but what was the point, really? The teaser was like something straight out of Lost in Space. Was Joe just giving himself a writing exercise; set up a silly-style teaser and try to spin a decent story out of it? TOS rarely did anthing on this level. I think the only real instance would be Abe Lincoln showing up in "The Savage Curtain".
Ship of Tears -- more Walter Koenig, and more about the telepath thing. Bester's character is rounded out more, which is nice.
Interludes and Examinations -- First let's talk about Franklin's addiction. Nicely handled over two seasons, better than when other series have made leads into drug addicts (I'm looking at you, ENT!). Here the writing is pretty perfectly subdued, and Richard Biggs is great in this episode. Never once did he go over the top or get hammy. I always saw him as believably erratic. There's a fine line between that and this:
My only problem with it all is that Franklin behaves as if he didn't realize his addiction, when back in "Ceremonies of Light and Dark" he confessed to Delenn that "I think I have a problem". Maybe this can be explained, but it strikes me as another example of Joe's sloppy writing. It's unfortunate, because the one line hurt the rather wonderful writing in this episode.
Also, gotta give them props; I never expected them to kill Kosh. That's the first genuine surprise I've had with this series (beyond "so Vorlons are just angel beings? lame."), and I liked it.
War Without End -- so nice to see Sinclair again and close out his story. It does make me wonder what Joe's original plan was for this to play out back before there was a Sheridan and stuff. These episodes sometimes get confusing where I'm not sure what time I'm in or who is who and where (like when they are in space suits). And I'm not sure I ever felt any real stakes; I always expected them to succeed. Simple temporal causality loop. So JMS has to create a false threat with the Ivanova distress call from the "possible future". It's trying to be Back to the Future, but makes no sense. If B4 always goes back in time, then this never happens and they shouldn't be picking it up. Of course, it could be that this is a further future of later events (we do see the exploding station shots that we saw in "Signs and Portents"), and knowing how clever Joe thinks he is, this wouldn't surprise me. Also, Ivanova refers to it as "Earth Alliance station Babylon 5", but right now they have seceded. Anyway, the episodes are reasonably effective, despite the fact that characters cross space as well as time inexplicably (Sheridan goes from random space in Sector 14 to being on Centauri Prime), and the almost-too-cute revelation that it was a time traveling B4 that saved the day 1000 years ago.
Walkabout -- boy, stims withdrawal sure is easy, huh? Franklin's little walkabout got overplayed over the next few episodes, and part of me thinks it's kind of silly since the station's only so long and he's probably just walking back and forth through different levels. Watching this one though made me kinda wish they had cast Richard Biggs as the guy who tells Locke to go on his walkabout on Lost.
Grey 17 is Missing -- a great idea with the missing level mystery that unfortunately doesn't pay off like it should. Great to see Robert Englund.
And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place -- when the monks showed up, I wondered to myself why it's always obvious Catholic monastic types when religious people appear in stuff, and never other modern Christian protestant types. So it was nice to see a Baptist pastor here (I'll credit B5 with being one of the only shows to have actual religions depicted). Unfortunately, the way he and Brother Theo interact was all wrong. He was just mean to him. In my experience, ministers of different faiths are much more respectful of each other as people and disagree on matters of doctrine. They don't get so petty as this. I'm sure Joe thought he was being satirical or something, but it was trite and off. Meanwhile, Londo's trap for Refa is brilliant and it was good to see some hints of the old Londo here.
Z'Ha'Dum -- Melissa Gilbert is fine, but I'm sorry, just because she's Bruce's actual wife is no reason to change actress when we've already seen a different woman as Anne Sheridan. On one hand, the Shadows make a very good point that growth generally only comes from conflict. People making peace and building together causes stagnation. That's the basic theme of the Tower of Babel story. But then I'm left asking, "okay, but WHY are the Shadows creating chaos this way?" Surely they don't WANT other races to evolve and improve, do they? Are the Shadows and the Vorlons both just toying with everyone else for their own purposes? Are the Shadows just doing this to stick it to the Vorlons, or are they getting something out of it. Or is this all just a nicely crafted lie to convince Sheridan? I can see the tactical wisdom in playing all sides against each other so you can take over once everyone's decimated. But otherwise, I feel I need to ask the Shadows their own question: what do you want? Also the notion that the Vorlons are responsible for all the telepaths makes sense to me. There was again never much tension here as any time a story says, "no, you've been lied to and the villains are really quite peaceful so let me explain" it doesn't turn out that way. The only story I can think of where the hero was actually convinced by something like that was in the His Dark Materials series; yet another reason to hate those books. ...but I'm off topic. G'Kar's ending narration was less jarring than Ivanova's last year. And at present I'm inclined to think Sheridan is not dead, but will eventually die on Z'Ha'Dum later. If time is indeed fixed, then the future with Centauri Prime all ruined cannot be altered. we'll see I guess.
-TK
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Post by captainbasil on Aug 15, 2013 5:31:12 GMT -5
I always liked how they handled Dr. Franklin's addiction. That's the cool thing about B5. They made all the characters flawed in some way and totally realistic. While Babylon 5 is not a dystopia, it does show that it may be the future, but everyone still has problems and old medical problems or diseases unfortunately get replaced with new ones. All the characters are 3 dimensional. This show really holds up even after 20 years.
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